Forums > Travel Yunnan > Thailand
@Dazzer, agreed. Also, the same can be said about Pattaya on possibly an even larger scale (and reputation wise too). Stay away from jetski rentals too, lest you want to put up with their scams.
@Dazzer, agreed. Also, the same can be said about Pattaya on possibly an even larger scale (and reputation wise too). Stay away from jetski rentals too, lest you want to put up with their scams.
@CROwai, Umm...actually, some people do have very boring lives here in China, especially elderly people so watching an accident unfold is a form of entertainment, even if it's not in a good way. Think of it as a "live" form of watching the news. I think what some of the posters have tried to say here is that watching an accident unfold is not an everyday event, so of course they'll start watching. For some people here (less than a few years ago, but still), just staring at a foreigner is a "form of entertainment". Those people's lives must be completely boring if watching a foreigner walk past them could grab their attention, so I think stopping to watch the circumstances that unfold relating to an accident will grab some people's attention. This would be the case even in the west.
Also, the other responses about possibly causing trouble for yourself if you get involved are true. Unfortunately, China does not have the same form of law and order as the west just yet. This explains people's lack of willingness to get involved.
All I know is China isn't much noisier than living in a big Australian city. For starters, few Chinese people have house parties and cause havoc on Friday and Saturday nights in your own neighborhood compared to Australia or the USA. This has been my experience and I have lived in 2 different places in Kunming for about 1 and a half years and I have able to sleep in peace every night. When I was living in west Texas a couple of years ago, I seem to recall an awful habit of disrepectful locals having extremely loud parties well into the night and most other residents not being "game enough" to tell them to shut the hell up. It was impossible to sleep and I was beginning to question why I didn't tell those idiots to shut the hell up. A nice middle-aged lady did finally do so, but it wasn't a long term solution.
In short, I'll take living in China anyday over living in that city over in Texas.
Hmm sounds interesting. I think if you really love the country enough, then why not? I was told by a Chinese academic last year that China is considering allowing dual citizenship sometime in the future. In fact, I believe Vietnam now recognises dual citizenship in limited circumstances So China could be next. Anyway, I hold multiple citizenship from a couple of European countries + the largest country in the South Pacific, so I can tell you that dual citizenship is of enormous benefit to anyone that holds it.
@Billdan, I think that explains why Chinese men married to SE Asian citizens are more likely to reside in those countries than the other way round? For starters, those countries are more foreigner friendly than China, and visas are easy to renew on a long-term basis. All you need is enough money to pay for the visa extension, that's it. It also explains the large number of other foreigners married to locals living there.
Would I care to take on Chinese citizenship? For now, nah...Thai citizenship would be better, besides, Thailand is that little bit more cosmopolitan than China, features visa-free travel to all ASEAN members (including Myanmar, soon) and recognises dual nationality if you become a naturalized citizen! Not to mention the low cost of living and great climate.
There are 10,000 Vietnamese students studying in Kunming? Wow...that seems like a lot. I have noticed some, but there seem to be far more Thai and Lao students here than Vietnamese. I seem to recall a few recent "international" incidents in the South China Sea which have not contributed to China becoming "the flavor of the day" in the minds of the Vietnamese, but anyway, I digress.
Vietnamese food in Kunming? Where? Certainly not any around wenlin jie or nanping jie. If it's anywhere else then I'm too lazy to travel there...
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What do you mean by "foreigners"? Everyone who is a non-citizen of Myanmar and wants to travel there is a foreigner. I doubt Burmese citizens require visas to return to their homeland.
Horrible tasteless, thick-crusted "cardboard" like pizzas that are a far cry from what they should be like. Way overpriced too. Wine may be good, but why bother when the nearby Prague Cafe makes much better pizza at a more reasonable price?
Great Mexican food and ice cream, excellent Raspberry smoothies and an overall good atmosphere. Can't do much about the low ceilings on the second floor, but the early closing time could be adjusted, after all, the nearby French Cafe closes at 1am.
Getting Away: Vang Vieng
发布者Yeah there are lots of hebrew speaking travellers in Vang Vieng these days. Same with regional tourists from Thailand - frankly given that Thai and Lao are nearly the same language I don't see how a Thai speaker can't read Lao, but apparently many can't hence the reason for the Thai signs you saw. Same in Thailand - at petrol (gas) stations near the Lao border, which are popular with Lao motorists you can see signs in Lao next to the Thai since there are some subtle differences between the two languages.
Getting Away: Vang Vieng
发布者@Senorboogiewoogie, in Laos everything is flexible due to the power of money aka corruption. I was in Vang Vieng around midnight back in 2009 and it was still noisy in parts, but generally quiet outside the center of action.
Also, while perhaps not a good idea, every foreigner living in Laos knows you can sleep with a Lao citizen of the opposite sex in the same room if you are discreet about it and you'll only get in trouble if you piss someone off. I also think that the government only sees the images of westerners in Thailand and the Philippines "buying" girls at girlie bars and wants to maintain a more lowkey image, but naturally no Vietnamese or Chinese (or Thai) truck driver would be without his karaoke and Lao prostitute in the border provinces. The reality is that prostitution is as big in Laos as anywhere else, but maybe just a little less visible. However, in Vientiane there are large numbers of local girls with western or other foreign "boyfriends", or in genuine relationships.
Booming Southeast Asian trade necessitates bilingual graduates
发布者Haha, well I don't think I was that pessimistic, and I do agree with you on some of your points - although being quite knowledgeable about languages myself, there is more overlapping of the dominant language from the more economically powerful country into the less dominant one than the other way round - i.e. despite what you said, there is very little Lao spoken in Vietnam, but the other way round there is quite a bit of Vietnamese understood in Laos. Lao officials on the Lao-Viet border can usually speak some Vietnamese, but Viet officials generally can't speak Lao. I have been there and know this for a fact. Same with Viet officials on the Chinese border - they can speak Chinese, but Chinese officials speak only Chinese and English, not Viet.
Vietnamese is also only understood amongst a very small minority of people on the Thai side of the Lao border, not many as you say...same with Thai in Myanmar but not Burmese in Thailand (except amongst the immigrant workers and some Burmese signboards near the Burmese border) in Thailand. As mentioned above, Chinese is quite strong in northern Laos, but Lao is non-existant anywhere in Chinese territory except when it comes to the Dai language, which is fairly close but not exactly the same language.
I've also found that the majority of South-East Asian Chinese language students here in Kunming don't speak much English at all for some strange reason. The ones back in their home countries that didn't major in Chinese are often quite good at English, so I guess there aren't that many polyglots around as you say - 2 languages seems to be what the average person knows and not more.
Although if we're on the subject of which SE Asian language to learn IN ADDITION TO English, which will continue to be important, then it must be Thai. Thai is understood throughout Thailand, Laos, western Cambodia and the Shan State of Myanmar. No other SE Asian language is as dominant as Thai.
This is reflected in the much greater interest amongst Chinese students in studying Thai than say, Vietnamese. I have met tons of Chinese students interested in, or with at least one semester of Thai behind them, but only two who had studied Vietnamese.
Booming Southeast Asian trade necessitates bilingual graduates
发布者Sounds good in principle, but learning to speak all SE Asian languages would require you to be some kind of linguistic genius and probably half a lifetime of devotion. Speaking only one of the languages from the region, say Thai or Burmese or Vietnamese, wouldn't help much in neighboring countries since each language in the region is not mutually intelligible with only limited overlapping...so such an approach would mean limiting your engagement to one country.
In parts of northern Laos and northern Myanmar, no attempts are made by Chinese settlers to learn the local language - everything (signboards, menus etc.) is in Chinese and locals [Laotians and Burmese] who can't speak this foreign language [Chinese] are left out.
Also, I don't think English should be forgotten - despite various levels of English fluency in the region, English is still the only global lingua franca and the global language of business. English is the only language you can successfully use in all SE Asian countries. While it's great to know Thai, Lao, Burmese etc. it isn't realistic unless you are living in those countries. I have also noticed that just like with English, Chinese learners of these SE Asian languages really struggle, and when encountering a local that speaks good English, the conversation will usually inevitably switch to English since the local will assume the other party can't speak their language well enough. It's only once fluency is achieved that this is overcome.
My recommendation would be for both Chinese and other foreigners interested in investing/doing business with the region to know how to speak English fluently, followed by becoming proficient in at least the basics of their host countries' language to at least show some interest and respect. Apart from those interested in becoming translators however, I personally think time and money is better spent gaining technical skills and then applying some language skills on the side - not the other way round.
I've done that and I'm doing quite well. I am an engineer that has worked in Vietnam and Thailand and I speak Thai and some Lao with an almost native accent (and can read and write both languages) - something that is of enormous benefit to me, but I have achieved this as a side passion rather than as my main job. Still, I barely speak Vietnamese and don't have the energy or time to work on it - in any case, doing business isn't difficult as most educated people there speak English anyway and I have a very good friend who helps me so it's all good. Ditto for Cambodia and Myanmar.
Getting Away: Luang Prabang
发布者There is an error in this article. Lao Airlines flies only twice (2) a week from Luang Prabang to Jinghong, not daily. They only just restarted this service recently and I highly doubt there would be enough demand for a daily service at this time. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if this service were to once again be suspended in the near future. Luang Prabang-Kunming flights are said to be restarted again in the near future too, but no date has been given.
Check out online copies of Lao Airlines' Champa inflight magazine for more details.