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China is not as safe as you think.

Alien (3819 posts) • 0

abcd: true that the wealthy are obviously a more interesting target than the poor in an unequal society.

True that 'foreigners' in China are often seen as likely to be relatively well off - also perhaps true that, on average, those who come here, especially from western countries, really are, though not necessarily to the degree that many people imagine.

True that people watch you to see how you're doing, but I don't see how this is different from curiosity. This is not necessarily racist and does not necessarily imply specifically 'racist' envy, although racism exists in China, as it still does to varying degrees almost everywhere.
The old lady was exaggerating.
I'm sometimes annoyed by the custom of open staring, but it's become a very minor issue - it only very rarely implies all of the issues you've outlined.

I think you should try to relax.

whereisshy (9 posts) • 0

Was this old woman particularly scary looking? Did she then slowly wipe the back of her hand across your cheek and whisper, 'thiiiinnneeerrrr'?

I suggest you start eating some sandwiches, sharpish.

yankee00 (1632 posts) • 0

"As for education in the US, I think the remarkable dumbing down of US education is a subject for another thread."

Education actually plays a primordial role is dissuading people from using violence, guns and other firearms as an eventual dumb solution to initial violence. What happened for centuries before in the USA, and in some way still happening nowadays, is still greatly contributing to how violence is perceived.

laotou's real life perceptions against Blacks proves the prejudice that still exists in USA and Western countries. And this kind of perception is also enforced by the inequalities and unfairness found the Western judiciary system.

Alien (3819 posts) • 0

@yankee: Does 'education' (please define) play an important role in dissuading the state from using violence? I think not.

The Dudeson's (1106 posts) • 0

@Tonyaod
I think you are talking about a more Americanized picture.
I am European and in Europe the news are more fact based, less opinionated and much less sensational.

Random attacks have very little to do with lifestyle. [hence the word random]
I am not in the high risk group of being attacked, nor are my friends Chinese or Western.

The only time out of,- what by now?-...7 or 8 incidents,...could be argued to be lifestyle related, if visiting a bistro/live music joint at early evenings is a high risk environment.

Walking out of restaurant (twice) once at day time once at evening hours and being attacked is not exactly a lifestyle issue.

Same as having a car crash or an accident or being an innocent bystander.
Also it is quite annoying hearing people to try, blaming it on me, because you can't grasp the idea, that the safety around you is [possibly] an illusion that you believe or believed, ...and for the record, so did I.

The majority of friends, as I mentioned before, have been victims of first hand violent crime or at least being pulled into attacks or fights.

So I wouldn't call it paranoid.

As Ex-military I am not disconnected from reality. I know there will always be violence among all species, it's part of what we are. And there are robberies and violence but in China the intensity of violence and the triggers are so unpredictable.

And it doesn't necessarily shock or surprise me that violence may occur. But I have issues with people trying to fake, or make me believe China is so safe. As well as the intensity of the violence and the root of it. Most times I encountered was more like stuff you would see in Sudan in the worst days. I don't mean the outcome but this unstoppable insane gravity of it.

A hate crime I understand there is a connection a passion for it.

But the stuff I saw was so meaningless and unreasonable, e.g. repeatedly jumping on a strangers head and trying to blind him, not caring if he lives or dies, for absolutely no personal gain, giggling and shouting for friends to help to jump on that persons head. Doesn't seem to make sense to me.

If you think it's paranoia, just check Yunnan TV channel 6 at around 2.30 p.m. My wife fell asleep and YNTV6 was running. Anyway all programs have those shows according to her. And that is just the reported and filmed stuff from bystanders. So I can't imagine how much is really going on.

Anyway
One of those countless reports was about this BBQ shop owner in Kunming who killed somebody with an ax after being out of his mind like a berserk (all filmed) when he was asked why he did it?
I quote :"That guy was annoying."

I am sure there are crazies in my country, U.S., or elsewhere but I am certain that it's not that intense. Except in conflict zones or unstable countries.

@Laotou
Another big problem with weapons, (all kinds) but especially fire arms, is... availability.

I would almost state that China is more dangerous than the U.S. if you keep in mind that a lot of stuff is not recorded, population and that there are less firearms around. If there would be a possible compare between those two, I would argue that China is at least as violent, if not more.

One more thing, most of those attacks happened in Beijing and I can direct you to a few spots in BJ, not dodgy or ghetto, bar street or anything, right in the city center and I am sure you would change your mind about strolling around there, just by getting reactions by walking there.

I have a friend that actually moved from China to D.C. and he thinks it's not as bad as people say.

Which was echoed about New Orleans. I have never been there so it's hard for me to judge, but it's what I heard.

As I said I dunno for the 4th time or so. The only thing I am saying is that China is not as safe as you think. Nothing else, not because of the media, or other stupid stuff but because I have been a victim far more often to file it as 'bad luck'.

I am not paranoid or jumpy, quite opposite. But that was the last strike.Enough to decided to take precautions and telling others about it.
In the end am not changing my life over the attacks, since I haven't done anything dangerous or bad, to got those bad things coming.
I am happy in China, I love Yunnan, but I am not trying to close my eyes from the things that are happening.

But since you like to blame it on me, or a possible paranoia. Then I can only say "maybe" you, who say those things, are: naive or stubborn, or not capable of accepting another opinion, or maybe just going into plain denial.
Whatever it is, ..."Good Luck" with it.

Plus,
Why would China be any safer than the rest of the world? Is it the political system, the people, the location, the food?
There are a just as many unhappy people here, than anywhere else in the world, with a much lesser stress tolerance and acceptance of violence, as well as less competent police force. So why would it be so strange to consider the possibility..of..."not as a safe as you think"?

So you don't have to believe me or follow my opinion or advise, it's non of my business.
But don't try to blame it on me, or call me paranoid. You don't want to believe it, it's fine. I like to be prepared, sorry for shaking you up and warning you.

As you keep on walking on pink clouds in cotton candy rainbow land think about this, as Laotzi said:

"True words are not beautiful and beautiful words are not true."

Alien (3819 posts) • 0

You "have been a victim far more often to file it as 'bad luck'".
OK - I have been a victim far less often - should I file it as 'good luck'? This in 12 years in Mainland China.
Now if you want to know if I think that shit happens, the answer is, yes it does.

abcdabcd (428 posts) • 0

"As Ex-military I am not disconnected from reality. I know there will always be violence among all species, it's part of what we are. And there are robberies and violence but in China the intensity of violence and the triggers are so unpredictable."

As opposed to the military? Where violence is predictable? Yep, that's the best kind of violence.

Maybe violence is part of what YOU are. But please speak for yourself. I never joined the military.

And basically, you just hit the nail on the head (pardon the pun using blunt instruments). You're experiencing what it's like being at the receiving end of senseless violence after having put on a monkey suit with an AK-47 strapped to your own back for so long.

Lesson learned? The hard way?

The Dudeson's (1106 posts) • 0

@abcdabcd
...woow!
Yep if someone knows all about the military, huh.
I won't talk about the Army because I guess it would challenge you a bit too challenging for your world vision.

Violence isn't just violence. When I joined the military I was a ware that I may have to takes one life but also that my life may be taken.

Which sounds like a fair concept, it's not how I wish the world would be, but sitting back home shouting towards the TV being to stingy or too lazy to actually "Do" something about the bad stuff that goes on in the world, never did anything for the better. So what have "You" done to make the world a better place, except posting on forums?

Before you try to make me a 'mercenary", keep in mind that military in different places in the world a very different. I could never join the US, Russian or Chinese Army, it's just to dull, dumb and hyper-subordinate nationalist.
I had the luxury of choice and even opinion. Besides that, I never fired a shot in combat.

"And basically, you just hit the nail on the head (pardon the pun using blunt instruments). You're experiencing what it's like being at the receiving end of senseless violence after having put on a monkey suit with an AK-47 strapped to your own back for so long."

Lesson learned?

...Yes, NATO states don't have AK47's.

The hard way?

...No, because I learned how to fight, so I never got seriously injured. I have a hard time accepting the intensity and wide acceptance of violence in China. Not as a last resort to solve problems but as a welcome option of convenience or entertainment.

In short to compare military service with random attacks, doesn't even make sense.

-No signs of conflict.
-Declaration of war.
-No demands.
-No time to prepare.
-No warnings.
-No diplomacy.
-No respect, and honor.

(if you ever get in a fight in China, you will see there is no honor)
-No rules and conduct.
-No visible affiliation to ones side,

except me being a foreigner.

Do I really have to continue the list? Nah! I think we both know it wasn't about my occupational choice but, another reason for your latest snarl. :)
____

..you really have no idea.
So how much more denial do I have to expect from you.

Again read the statement I made in my OP, you don;t even have to agree. Just take it easy, and keep in mind it is still a mathematically possibility that China may not be as safe as you think. If you want to blame the attacks on my Army service or even if I would be Adolph Hitler, it still is a valid point.
Sorry to disappoint.

Just take it easy, mate.

No hard feelings I am a pacifist, I am on your side..

Alien (3819 posts) • 0

@dudeson: "to compare military service with random attacks, doesn't even make sense."

right - the military is organized to bring a hell of a lot more violence down on people, most of whom are usually noncombatants, than random violence does, and is furthermore at the command of institutions whose goal is to dominate, control and/or exploit others in a mass fashion.

The Dudeson's (1106 posts) • 0

@Alien
Yes you are right if you are into Hollywood, one sided description of military, I agree with you.

Most movies and media seem to show this picture, isn't that the thing that brainwash us, to fear and paranoia?
As well as just one side of the story,-ideas, ...there is nothing more fitting than your description.

It's very Orwell-ian what you describe. As I said before that may be the American way of military, that is not how 'we' run our military. Speaking for most European countries.

Don't be so fast to judge, my friend.

You are fast to throw judgments on me, and people in the military. I don't think running a Nietzsch-esque "All soldiers are murderers" —mentality is the right way, and inaccurate.

If the people that get killed are mostly noncombatants, then yeah that Army needs to learn how to use their weapons better.

Sounds more like a club of imbeciles. But as I said I guess you are referring to the U.S. military.

It's still denial though my friend, and it's ok, really! I don't mind also bashing soldiers or ex-soldiers won't help.

...at last, so what's your point?

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