" look around you at your neighbors who have kids but no cars & ask them how they do it, and how almost everybody did it until about 5-6 years ago."

I used to live in an area in the north where the transportation condition was identical to tigertiger's. People who have kids have no choice but to stay home after 7pm (last mini bus) or at peak time. It's also inconvenient, because people need to take that bus to get to the main road, where there are more taxis or main buses. For those who don't have their own transportation, it's quite a challenge to even get to work or school and then back home at night. That bus only comes every 30 minutes and is always overloaded. I used to take it when I first moved to my previous place, and it was so small that I always had to stick my head through its sunroof. I decided to buy a scooter a week after. For families though, a car would definitely be more convenient. At least they would be using it for several family members, unlike those living downtown who are actually the ones who contribute the most to congestion and pollution by having each family member taking out their respective car all at the same time.

I've contemplated those "laotou" e-"carriages" - the infamous boom-boom che's that occasionally cluster outside grocery stores. I've occasionally seen expat families doodling around town with their kids in similar vehicles. Low budget, low cost, not great when it rains...but great for commuting n avoiding street parking.

I've contemplated those "laotou" e-"carriages" - the infamous boom-boom che's that occasionally cluster outside grocery stores. I've occasionally seen expat families doodling around town with their kids in similar vehicles. Low budget, low cost, not great when it rains...but great for commuting n avoiding street parking.

@tigertiger: all your neighbors have cars - but then there are plenty of ordinary people who don't. And this division, becoming geographic, is indeed a growing problem in Chinese society. I avoid it by not living in an area where all my neighbors have cars - there are plenty of buses near here, and my neighbors are as good as anybody else. Class society screws everybody up. If the city government were more open to outspoken feedback, it would help - more bus routes rather than more cars.
My condolences.

I would check some of the other recent froums on renting or buying any housing in Kunming. I will repeat part of my previous rant. I have been here over 10 years and have bought, sold and rented houses and offices. Working with the largest XX real estate agency here was a total expensive disaster for us this summer. Beware they lie, cheat, do not know, tell stories and even steal. The smaller independent agents were the only really helpful ones. I was happy to pay them. We did everything in Chinese. I used my own Chinese legal contracts. The ones XX agency uses favor them and the landlords NOT you. Many folks here rent only to find out the landlord has decided to sell after a few months. Yes, there are also great landlords who keep the rent the same year after year.

This car discussion is funny...back home we all have cars. So I wouldn't judge the Chinese ^^
@robinhood, you definitely want to live in the south near Dianchi Lake or in the north near the Expo garden if you have a family and kids. The north is better for the airport. But with the subway opening...one day, the south might not be so bad in the future ^^

The Chinese want to emulate Westerners with individual car ownership. You can't really blame them. But in no country is it more apparent that the system is flawed than here, with the massive population.

My advice:
New Asia Athletics Park - South Kunming (Guandu district)

Advantages:
- Direct freeway to the airport!
- Direct access to the Metro Line which already runs in the South
- Close to Chenggong University Town in case you take up any teaching position.
- Lower rent
- Good size apartments and relatively new (no lead-poisoning problem in case it's something to worry about in older places)
- Cheaper groceries
- No problems during rainy seasons with flooding
- Carrefour supermarket nearby
- More countryside nearby
- Cleaner air and less dust!
- No restrictions on water / reduced water pressure during drought
- International kindergarten(s)
- Quality sports facilities
- Apartments and houses in gated communities with plenty of green, playgrounds and fitness machines around.
- International expat community
- PARKING! Yes, parking isn't much of a problem here. All buildings have MEGA-size underground parkings.
- The list goes on :)

Hope this helps ^_^

@Silvio DaVinci, what you describe sounds like an interesting place! Does it have interesting places to hang out? How's the nightlife? Are there any Mandarin training schools?

I don't understand why people might want to live near an airport.

I'm not BLAMING Chinese, or anybody else anywhere (such as 'back home', wherever that might be), for wanting to own a car, I'm simply pointing out that it's a bad idea. Widespread unnecessary private automobile use has done enough damage, and continues to do enough damage, everywhere, why make things worse anywhere?