"I agree that schools should teach practical stuff in school instead of the crap they teach now."

Actually, In my class, I do teach students practical stuff and we would spend a lot of time on talking about things happened in our daily life. Like the issue we are talking now we have discussed several times^_^.

jonny9
Spot on! There is considerable academic debate these days as to what precisely IS Chinese culture. Chinese culture has been severely damaged over the last few hundred years - so it would be NICE if we could return to some simple basics, such as:

1. Honesty. If one can't tell the truth, then don't say anything.
2. Courtesy/Hospitality.
3. Honor. To respect one's family name for past and future generations.
4. Social Responsibility and Compassion. Whatever happened to community and helping each other. Although this can border on unwanted snooping, gossip, etc - it also has the positive benefit of helping each other - looking for opportunities to help others and the removal of shame and embarrassment so we can seek assistance from others. The central government is trying to demonstrate social responsibility and compassion through some very high profile actions. Let's hope it trickles down rapidly.

While these things certainly aren't endemic to China - they are severely exacerbated by the sheer density and population, in a country roughly the same size as the USA with 4-5x the population density.

To get back on topic for TheSwedishGuy (TSG), your home has a respect issue. The in-laws AND your wife don't respect or honor you. The culture card as played by the in-laws is pure donkey pooh. Right is right and wrong is wrong. Lylian addresses normal sane people - you're not dealing with normal sane people - as such, logic doesn't work - it's equivalent to explaining your position to a cow. You just look crazy for trying to have a sane logical conversation with a cow.

Whatever you decide to do - have MULTIPLE plans to repair the home situation to return or create a sustainable harmonious home life. And ALWAYS have MULTIPLE exit strategies for worst case scenarios.

I normally don't encourage or condone divorce as it's a terminal solution, but your child's welfare is at stake, so someone has to make the tough decisions for him. As you already were well aware of impending issues early on in this relationship - aka making your son a Swedish citizen - abandoning your son to the in-laws is obviously not a viable solution.

Wish you well whatever choices you decide to pursue. It'll be a LONG painful path - and just remember the old business adage - never toss good money after bad - or, if you play poker, "know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em, and know when to walk away."

Seems like the entire gokm community is supporting you.

I have a suggestion for TheSwedishGuy but I don't know what would you think on this:

There is a TV program in Shanghai TV Station named "幸福魔方(Magic Square for Happiness)". Many people go to this program to solve their family conflicts. They have well-known psychologist on spot and help them to analyze their situations. 90% of problems will be solved at the end.

I understand many people don't want to make their family problems to public. However, if TheSwedishGuy still loves his wife and want to save the marriage he has to talk to her and her family. But as I know Chinese people would not like to speak out when we have different opinions. We would keep them in mind and then make situation worse. I believe that at the beginning the wife's family would not did those crazy things. Lacking communication made everythings turned to worse. Now the program I menthioned above will help them to sit down together and talk sanely.

What do you think of it?

TSG, your early post says they want you to get a job. I assume this means you have no job in China, this could be the biggest souce of the problem.

Why don't you get a job?

We don't know that he doesn't have a job. Job wanted ads means nothing. I always have a job and am always applying for more jobs, or seeing if I can do more work on the side. Also, even if he doesn't have a job we have no idea if that is really the issue, as he might still be working on something else for the future, or simply returning from a break.

Anyway, good luck to you SWG, don't let it turn you against Chinese folks, (or any other folks), and seems Kunmingtiger's story is worth keeping on file.

Yes we don't know if "he might still be working on something else for the future, or simply returning from a break".

One thing I can be sure is that in China, people especially elder generation would think in a family, the husband should work outside and the wife should take care of the family.

Actually my story is on file, a police report was lodged with the police in Wen Hua Xiang Sept 24 2009. The matter was dealt with my the CBI from downtown and later at the local court in Wen Hua Xiao Qu.

Since then I have met someone else and and she and her family have been very good to me. I'm certainly lucky to have another chance. it's a sad story with a happy ending.

I made a mistake, an error in judgement and learnt an important lesson. But the Chinese people I certainly respect and will continue to do so.

My apologies to Lylian with my careless wording in my previous post. I meant to not say that Chinese teachers always teach crap in thier calsses only that the content of their textbooks often avoid serious and real social issues.

For example my teacher brought up the issue of domestic violence in class, a serious issue. But most students aren't married so it doesn't really relate to their lives but I told her that often violence steams from underlying issues.

I used my personal experience as an example that if provocations arise sometimes tempers fray and things happen. Obviously talking about an issue in front of your classmates it might embarrass the teacher so I asked her after class how my course of study could prepare me for making a statement to the police and then being summoned to court and making a written statement there, understanding family law without legal counsel she simply she said she didn't know.

I was at the police station for eight hours, in the next room for two hours when they interrogated them and got them to confess their culpability. You never know the limitations of your Chinese until you run into the police, legal and medical professions.

The point I was trying to make was I don't know criminal or civil law in the PRC the stuff I learned at school did not apply in real life. Being informed of my legal rights at court was a nightmare. I must read and then sign legal documents that are complex. I wasn't allowed a translator unless it was court appointed and they didn;t have anybody on staff in legal training in English so it couldn't be done.

You must careful as to what you say because it's recorded, written into a statutory declaration and then signed. No mis understandings once you sign on the dotted line. Chinese teachers are teachers not lawyers they don't understand complex legal issues that's not their job.

International lawyers here deal in commerce, contract law etc not criminal law generally speaking.

I didn't mean to attack Chinese teachers in general or you in particular but often they can't give me any useful legal advice . If my teacher doesn't know what chance do we students have.

Back on topic Swedish guy take any useful advice from this threat and the best of luck to you. Keep your chin and keep your friends close.

Lylian
I HIGHLY recommend against jumping on the television. These shows are for entertainment purposes, not for resolving actual issues and can actually do more harm than good. They have NO responsibility to either party. In the USA, some would advise marriage counseling - but my experience with marriage counselors is that in general, they're all nutso.

An alleged "certificate" in marriage counseling has as much value as used toilet paper. Before you buy any consumer product, you can read the label to verify the contents, but marriage counselors, psychologists, and psychiatrists in general are discouraged or professionally forbidden from discussing their personal lives with patients. THis means you don't know the contents of the alleged professional counseling you - but you're letting them into your head.

That's a ludicrous proposition. Mental health "counselors" are people you pay money to, to be your best friend for an hour a week or whatever your insurance or wallet will cover.

I'm sure TSG already has several plans in his mind, hopefully this forum helped him to develop several optimal win-win solutions. And hopefully TSG can avoid the criminal acts that kunming tiger experienced. The thing about intimidation is - it can escalate until it reaches MAD (mutually assured destruction), but KM tiger was just unfortunate to hookup with criminals - plain and simple.

I hope KM Tiger, assuming the police allowed or permitted it - put his crappy tufei (bandit) ex-in-laws in jail and I hope that criminal mark gets put on their ID cards.

And for you long-term expats looking for long-term relationships potentially leading to marriage and families with children - referral by word of mouth works best. Get to know your friends so they get to know you, know your personal tastes, desires, etc AND trust and respect you - they'll WANT to introduce you to nice women (or men) because they like you and think you're good material.

It is vain trying to make a cultural quarrel here. As Jonny9 acutely pointed out, the SwedishGuy' problem is largely a financial one rather than a cultural one. Lylian's comments only muddle up the cultural aspect of this issue into absurdity. (Forgive me if I offended you, didn't mean it. Only want to participate in the debate.)

Like laotou said, what is exactly Chinese Culture here? To separate or alienate a child from his parents? It is unacceptable in any culture except in extreme circumstances. The true Chinese culture has long gone except the empty rhetoric and colorful symbols. Buddhism or Taoism or Confucius would have done good deeds with Chinese culture if and only if Chinese people would have actually minded them, but they only mind them with their prayers asking for fortune and good luck. Then what's left is the confusion of monetary driven yearning and practice, as Jonny9 termed it "lucky combination".

Back to SwedishGuy again, he must work with his wife, to unite their own family or to break it, only two of them can make it happen. If both of them are truly committed to each other, they should be able to overcome any difficulties, be it financial or cultural, in Kunming or in Sweden. When truly committed, human souls are without cultural boundary.

I have lived in both east and west side of "culture" for a long time, I have seen many interracial marriages, some of them are in excellent conditions, some of them are broken down, just like family scenarios in any part of the world. It's about individuals, not about culture. So don't mix culture with individual mentality, they are different things.

By the way, as the older generation, my mom and dad never thought women should stay at home wait on their husbands, even my mom herself was never a stay home mom, not because of financial reason, it's just her independent and assiduous spirit. Are we talking about "Culture" now?

I never said or meant " To separate or alienate a child from his parents" or the other behaviours of the wife's family were acceptable or right. I just tried to analyze why they have these insane behaviours from the point of view of a native Chinese.

We are not specialists doing research here and when we talk about Buddhism or Taoism or Confucius, they are not abstract theories far away from us, instead, they are together with us everywhere in our daily life. But even many Chinese people don't notice or can explain why they have those thoughts or behaviours.

For example: in Spring Festival Chinese people would post "关羽" or "张飞"'s images on the door or worship ancestors with food, that's from Taoism.

Filial piety is a very important part of Confucianism and to have latter generations and make the family bigger is one way to represent the filial piety. It's like this kid belongs to the whole family. And in a Chinese family, grandparents has the absolute right of speech. Then it can explain why the wife's parents feel so confident that they can do whatever they want to their grandchild.

As to Buddhism, if you guys have learned Chinese you may found there were some words like"世界""方便 ", do you know they are also from Buddhism?

outsider, are your parents farmers? Here the wife's parents are not well-educated farmers. They consider things much more from their experience, characters, mood, and what ancestors told them, not wisdom, knowledge or sanenesss. Moreover, it's my fault that I should say MOST(not every) of elder generations expect husband works outside and wife take care of the family(didn't mean wifes don't work).