How could they even adopt your son legally, if your son is a Swedish citizen? I guess this is not even possible.

Sorry to hear that. I can't really give you good advices so I wish you good luck!
I just want to add that soon it will be 1 year with my chinese girlfriend and is the best person I ever met. We are great together.
We have been reading your posts and talked about it. I already met her parents twice and I can say they are not like that at all. She also found the reaction of your wife and her family not very good. She doesn't agree and say they will never do something like that.

I agree we have very different cultures but that doesn't mean both can't be a bit more open. I'm in China so I try to adapt to their culture and my GF and her parents know I'm foreigner so they try to adapt too.

If I were in your place I'll do everything to give the best to my child and will definitely stop my relationship with a "mother" that thinks like that. I know it's easy to say from here but I think everybody here will do the same.
I remember a chinese friend had to leave his chinese girlfriend (a very good girl and good friend of mine) because he had to go back to his hometown take care of his parents. In China the close family it's really important and i guess it's a big problem for other cultures like europe, US, etc. to understand.
I don't agree with what this chinese family is doing with you but I also admit that is very difficult to change a culture in someone's mind.

I hope everything goes fine.
Cheers!

here are some extracts from the family laws (adpotion) of the PRC,

Article 3.
Adoption shall not contravene laws and regulations on family planning. (remember,one child policy is still in force in china.)

Article 6.
Adopters shall meet simultaneously the following requirements: (with a few exception, tho)
(1) childless;
(2) capable of rearing and educating the adoptee; and
(3) having reached the age of 35.

Article 10.
Where the parents intend to; place out their child for adoption, they must act in concert.

leave everything else ....nationality of the adoptee........etc aside, it seems the in-laws 'scheme of arrangement' is doomed without a lot of bribe. :-)

TheSwedishGuy, I feel sorry for you, too.

I am a Chinese girl and have been teaching Chinese as a second language for about two years. From what you said I can tell it's not anyone's fault but because of culture difference. Have you ever heard about in China getting married is to marry a family instead of a person? Even for a Chinese couple they have to face and deal with a lot of contradiction between husband's family and wife's family, say nothing of a very open European to a very conservative Chinese farmer family.

Despite you will not be happy, I should say what your wife's family did are quite acceptable and common in China.

Now the point is: we can't change each other's values in one or two years. What you need to figure out is the relationship between you and your wife. If this issue is possible to solve, then you two should pull together, instead of blaming each other.

I want to share a sentence which I like very much: When something happened, if you like it, enjoy it; don't like, avoid it; can't avoid, change it; can't change, accept it. Maybe you don't like the way Chinese people do, but it seems that you have no better choice right now.

I hope you can calm down and find the best way to solve the problem.
Good luck! ^_^

@Lylian,

Did you see Encrypted's post above?

It shows that there is no uniform, basic culture difference between Europeans and Chinese.
Instead there is a series of possible differences which may or not be there. In other words, the culture difference is also between the Chinese and the Chinese, as much as anything.

Second, most of what we're calling a culture difference is actually just economic or political. The proverb "When you marry a Chinese..." could be replaced with "when you marry an Indian, An Algerian, an Afghan, a Brazilian' etc.

Actually I think calling problems culture difference is not very useful and clouds what is happening. Sure, people are different in different places, thats normal, but these arguments happen within China also, and don't forget that all this so-called Chinese family culture is exactly how many western families were up until 50 or 60 years ago, especially in religious families.

I think that while your advice is obviously well intentioned, it sounds like you think it is useful to frame it (at worst)- an international disagreement, (at best)-as a culture difference, so that no one is blamed. Then you end up basically saying that the Swedish guy should accept the situation, because if we don't like things, we should accept them, since we cant change them. I know this is common reasoning here at the moment, but it is dismal and defeatist. I have heard it a lot recently, and I think it is cynicism dressed up as cliched platitudes.

1) These people are spouses and friends, not representatives of countries.

2) The problem involves responsibility and avoiding blame may mean avoiding responsibility and therefore a clear picture of what is happening.

3) Much of what is normal in China is not acceptable in China.

4) Why is Swedishguy obliged to conform to his wife's family but she doesn't need to join his Swedish family? Seems they live in both countries, and her family wants them to go to Sweden, but on their terms.

5) Why should he see this as just some problem to navigate around, as an issue of personal adaptation? The problem is also a group of fully alive people, they are not a force of nature, not a situation, they are other actors who have stakes in this-in other words they are not a problem to adapt to, they are people who can be talked to and called into question.

Thanks jonny9,

Culture difference does not only mean the difference between Chinese culture and western cultrue, but also between two areas, cities, or even two villages. That's why I said "Even for a Chinese couple they have to face and deal with a lot of contradiction between husband's family and wife's family, say nothing of a very open European to a very conservative Chinese farmer family."

Here I give you an example: I have a friend, who is from Guilin, southern part of China, married a woman from Beijing, northern part of China. When they have their kid, problems came out. I remember above someone said in China it's very common that young couples gave their kids to grandparents to take care. It is true. In my friend's hometown, usually wife's parents go to young couple's home to take care of the kid because mother-in-law and daughter-in-law are "natural enemy". However, in his wife's hometown grandchildren should be take care by husband's parents. So, my friend's parents went to Beijing, then the battle started (In China, the southerns and northerns are with quite different habits, customs and traditions).

I am telling this story for showing culture difference is the biggest but not the only problem for intercultural marriage. We should see there are still lots of foreigners married Chinese girls and they are living happy life, at the same time, many Chinese couples or Swedish couples or American get divorced. Therefore, this couple must have their own problems.

Chinese people are much influenced by Buddhism, Confucianism as well as Taoism. And for those people who experienced destitute times and not well-educated they think money is the guarantee. 5000-year history, 30-year Reform and Open, traditions, good or bad, are not easy to be changed.

I didn't mean the Swedish guy should accept everthing in China. There is an order for "When something happened, if you like it, enjoy it; don't like, avoid it; can't avoid, change it; can't change, accept it." Actually, there is another sentence followed it. It's " Change your concept then you can accept everthing". These sentences are much like from Buddhism so we may have different understanding to them. Can we say this is the culture(religion) difference between you and me?

You said "Much of what is normal in China is not acceptable in China." I think it's "Much of what is normal in China is not acceptable by European people, but it's acceptable by Chinese people".

To answer your Q 4): In English,there is a saying "When in Rome, do as the Romans do"; In Chinese, we also have "Ru xiang sui su". That means, if his wife lives in Sweden, sure she should do as the Swedish do.

I am quite agree with your opinion "they are people who can be talked to", so I think the Swedish guy should talk to his wife. Anyway, blame can release your dissatisfaction but cannot solve any problem.

"....When I am around her family they don't even let me play with my son, always taking him away from me and think I am selfish that I want to spend time with him. They do get angry if I take him out alone just to have some nice alone time with him... "

tactical moves like the above, to isolated the father from his kid is nothing to do with culture differences. it is a sign of intention. so dont go mixing up culture differences with bad/good intention.

then, not all chinese 'nongmin' families are 'gold diggers'. i know one Oz white guy who married a girl and the whole 'nongmin' family in guangxi, the guy is still there doing the farm work, growing sugar crane and rice on the girl's family pot of land. the guy was a bank manager in melbourne before. interesting, isnt it?

"....When I am around her family they don't even let me play with my son, always taking him away from me and think I am selfish that I want to spend time with him. They do get angry if I take him out alone just to have some nice alone time with him... " Is it from the very beginning or after something happened?

Lylian thanks to you 2.
As to culture difference within China, we both agree on it, and we both pointed it out-but we come to very different conclusions.

Chinese are not all the same, and the the opposite is also true. One reason my Chinese friends are close friends with me rather than with their parents' friends or with their co-workers, is that OUR "culture" is more similar. So that is why I am saying it is very weak to just blame everything on culture.

When I said that not everything that is normal in China is acceptable in CHINA, I MEANT SPECIFICALLY NOT ACCEPTABLE FOR CHINESE PEOPLE. This is true in many places-not just China, what people live with can still hurt them, make them unhappy, and make them regret or complain, no matter how common it is.

I disagree that Chinese people are influenced by Taoism, or Buddhism any more. I think, there are other things.

Though if we want to name isms, I would suggest Confucianism (the big one), Stalinism, and western popular commercial culture are the lucky combination. In any case, maybe that is a bit too off topic.

The idea you mention of changing your concept, then you can accept everything, is a mystical idea-, useful at certain times for the individual's view of life. To bring it out as a general guide, to be used in any old context (even for social problems), is to abuse it. And with potentially terrible consequences. That kind of platitude is exactly the kind of hidden cynicism I was thinking of-if we don't like injustice, we should just try another pair of glasses. That is inappropriate, don't you think so? And the issue here with blame, is not to pursue it. Instead it is not to let blame be avoided at all costs( in the cynical sense of denying a truth) that I pointed to above. Not to let blame be avoided to preserve a false harmony.

And do you understand that the boy is Swedish, they lived in Sweden before, and now the family wants them to go live in a Sweden again for 5 years according to the Chinese family's plan? We
would have to say "When in Sweden do as the Chinese in-laws want you to do, live there without your son" (:

So that is why I don't think 'when in Rome fits' or the "'Chinese verses western' thing fits. Yes this version of craziness is a Chinese one, but its not the Chinese-ness of it that is important. People who are also Chinese have already looked at this thread and said they think the in-laws way of doing things is not good.

Swedish guy,

You have done the right thing by coming onto this forum for a second opinion.

I was married to a Chinese woman until recenty. One night she brought up the topic of the financial hardships of her family members and how easy it would be for them on australia's generous social system.

I was sympathetic to their case but I pointed out to her that all this being true it was also irrevelant due to the fact that she and her family members were neither Australian citizens or permanent residents.

Three weeks later she returned and delivered an ultimatium as follow

1. I was to lodge an application for permanent residence status on her behalf immediately, it was to be approved within the month.

2. Permanent seperation

3. Legally adopt a child although I was to have no regular contact with the kid.

If I didn't consent to all of the above the family would reserve the right to take further action against me. (unspecified) Now all of this was bad enough but the manner in which it as delivered was interesting. Her tone varied from straight offensive, demeaning even threatening.

I immediately contacted my embassy (as you should) and they told me that we couldn't even apply for permanent visa status for two reasons . The first being that we needed to have been married for at least 12 months and second be co habitating (which we were). So any application would not have been successful.

To legally adopt a child in China as a foreigner I needed to provide proof of income, notorizied by the embassy and a certificate of employment from my employer in China. ( I couldn't provide either as I work off the books here)

When I raised these concerns with her I was just sneered at . I mean even the advice of the embassy was rejected out of hand. They simply said that unless I signed a false statuory declaration with the embassy to the effect that we were co habitating then further action against me was forthcoming.

The advice I got from my embassy is that a parent or legal guardian of an Australian citizen can apply for permanent residence in Australia. They even threatnen to have a third party lodge an application in my name using my particulars with the embassy to have the visa issued.
I contacted my embassy and had them red flagged.

A night when I was out they broke into my home and stole my passports. credit card and money. I came home and a major confrontation broke out. They threatened to evict me forcibly from the premises and steal everything in the apartment unless I went ahead with the application, adoption etc.

I contacted the police who arrrested them and the returned my belonging under threat of prosecution. I can't speak highly enough of the police on this matter. A report was lodged and I informed the embassy of the theft and recovery of the passport as I'm required to do by law.

Please note the following

1. As mentioned before, you need your spouse's consent to travel with the kid out of the country. It must be in writing.

2. Intimidation, coercion even violence are simply tools, means to an end. Never invite trouble but expect it. They will hassle your employer until you are fired, your friends, steal your things and so on.

3. Check with your embassy to see if your spouse or ex spouse can apply for residence in Sweden now or at any point in the future.

4. Check the laws regarding adoption also custody to see if they can claim custody of the kid. As far as his nationality is concerned they could simply register the kid with the local authorities and claim he's Chinese by descent. Check this with the embassy.

5. They are trying to establish a bond with the kid as a counterweight to your influence that means removing you for his sphere of influence. they might be thinking your marriage is on the rocks so they are thinking past you.

6. Make sure that kid doesn't leave your sight once you lose him you;ll won't be able to track him down.

7. Don't make your concerns known to your wife or your in laws especially the leaving the country with your kid part. Possession is 90% of the law.

I agree that schools should teach practical stuff in school instead of the crap they teach now.

This is not intended as an anti Chinese or anti inter racial marriage thing as I know lots of foreigners who have successful marriages with Chinese in Kunming. Each case has its own particular circumstances.

But in laws have their own agendas and if your wife can't rise above that then expect more of the same.

I agree with a previous post about not putting up with any $#*& from relatives or in laws. if they become confrontational call 110, if you blink you'll be lost.

I've had hired goons come after me, been asked to have meetings to secluded places, people go to the police station to look up my details on the computer so on and so forth.

Always be ready to make a move at once and keep your true friends close they will be invaluable to you if nothing happens.

Some consulates and embassies while closed and still able to respond to requests for assistance after hours in the middle of the night. They did in my case.

The grandparents can look after the kid there's no need for an adoptation unless they intend to remove you in the near future.