Since we've been censored by Gokunming yet again and the thread has been locked, I give you,,, KIA!
Seahorse wrote:
"Ah Dan,
I did chuckle when you said I was like you. Although we can agree on a few points, I feel I am probably not at all like you in my world view. Yet, I agree with you in some points. I still stand to the belief that religion of any form including the religion of atheism should not be in the public schools. Teachers in public schools are there for teaching not indoctrination.
Although, I am not really like you, I feel I am completely different from your stereotypical religious person. I am never going to yell at a person to repent or burn. I voted democrat in the last election, and I believe very much in helping the down-trodden of life. I like to have a drink and laugh with the boys. I am very accepting of all people no matter what they believe, and I believe manipulation is no way to get people to believe something. From what I can tell, this is how teachers and administration feel at KIA. Why use a chapel to manipulate people? In the end, are manipulated people followers of the religion? From what I can see, students are given an opportunity to believe or not to believe.
In biology, my child learned about both creation and evolution. I'm sure the teacher leaned more towards creation, but both sides were taught. In philosophy classes, the teacher wants the students to think and make a decisions. It would be silly to teach only one thing then try to force students to believe it. I believe this, and I think this is the thoughts of KIA; therefore, this is why I made the response about heaven being full of people who love God not fearing hell. KIA wants people to investigate then make a decision out of love not manipulation or fear. My statement was a response to Zhubajie saying low church goers were fanatical and intense thus implying KIA chapels were meant to send fear into someone who isn't like-minded.
Going back to my statement about indoctrination. In many ways, isn't this what Chinese public schools are doing—indoctrinating? You don't get pissed about it because they indoctrinate in your religion—atheism or love of self. Yet, you get irate and call Christians narrow-minded for wanting to do the same at a school where parents choose to send their children. Such hypocrisy. The hypocrisy of non-religious, atheists, and pagans astound me. They get all bent out of shape if opposing views are being taught, but they could care less if their views are being taught. Why do you care if the opposing views are being taught in a small international school where parents choose and pay to send their children?
And again I will say I don't believe KIA is indoctrinating. I have heard of children from non-believing families going years to KIA without making a decision to become religious.
Finally, I believe KIA hires people of all Christian backgrounds as long as they can agree with their beliefs. There are certain beliefs which can not be overlooked in the faith, and it doesn't matter what persuasion you are from if you can agree with those keys beliefs. Also, KIA always seeks to hire professional teachers. Most teachers teach their subject, and they have very little if anything to do with teaching outside their subject. Therefore, KIA isn't looking for evangelists to come in and convert the heathen; instead, they want professional teacher who will teach math, English, history, and science at a professional level. As far as hiring atheists, the answer is no. Why would they hire someone who has a vast difference in world view, and why would someone want to work at KIA who has such a gap in world view? Well, I will backtrack on myself. I am not sure, but it might be possible that a national Chinese teacher who teaches Mandarin isn't religious, but this would be the only exception, and I am not even sure about this. Again, they are there to teach Mandarin and care for the students not to convert. All foreign hires will be Christian.
You guys seem to be so scared of a hidden agenda. KIA doesn't exist under a hidden agenda. They exist to give foreign children in Kunming an excellent learning environment from loving teachers who care about their well being. I am sure a few teachers have never once tried to convert a student. Instead, they teach and love them, and in the end if they believe, it was the choice of the student."
////My reply (without the use of a single word of profanity this time, thank you for erasing my entire post btw instead of just taking ONE word out. I didn't feel like wasting my time at all.)
"I still stand to the belief that religion of any form including the religion of atheism should not be in the public schools."
—That's great, but you are contradicting yourself repeatedly in your posts so I doubt that's how you (or KIA) really feels. Come to think of it, that's EXACTLY what KIA doesn't believe by adding a chapel, classes teaching religious values (by the way: take a look at what values the bible also teaches apart from the most obvious ones: genocide, rape, murder etc, it's all there. Are these values taught in KIA as well?), creationism, not hiring non-Christians and the fact that all students MUST attend weekly prayer meetings.
"In the end, are manipulated people followers of the religion?"
—Sure are. All believers are manipulated into their faith ever since the many religions were invented to search for answers and protection against the weather, wild animals, invading enemies and so on. Religions served to ease fears and solidify loyalty to the leaders so they could be sent to the slaughter with a confuse idea of eternal life and other empty promises.
"In biology, my child learned about both creation and evolution. I'm sure the teacher leaned more towards creation, but both sides were taught,,
It would be silly to teach only one thing then try to force students to believe it."
—Yes, silly indeed. So I assume KIA is teaching the kids about Muslim, Norse, Buddhist and Aztec religions as well as Scientology and Mormonism right? On an equal footing of course. A biology teacher teaching creationism and so-called intelligent design is a hack in my book, and a disgrace to my profession.
"In many ways, isn't this what Chinese public schools are doing—indoctrinating? You don't get p****d about it because they indoctrinate in your religion—atheism or love of self."
—First of all, get your facts straight. Atheism isn't a religion, not even close. China might teach the kids to sing the anthem and express love for the country and the CCP but I could show my kid his passport, showing him he's not Chinese and at the very least I could tell him how things really work. Consistent indoctrination from religion on the other hand is worse since there is no breathing space. You force your beliefs on them at home AND in the schools, and I bet you prefer Christian friends for them as well. Two words: Child abuse.
"Finally, I believe KIA hires people of all Christian backgrounds as long as they can agree with their beliefs,,As far as hiring atheists, the answer is no."
—I wonder what the government would say to this. Maybe someone should tell them?
"Why would they hire someone who has a vast difference in world view?"
—Oh I don't know, maybe to get professionals who care about facts and science and don't base a large part of their thinking on ONE of the tens of thousands of religions that have existed?
"Ah Dan, I did chuckle when you said I was like you."
—Great that you could indulge in some condescending laughter on my behalf. How very Christian of you. How about I perform a little monkey boy dance for you? What do you say? Maybe you could gather up all of your Christian friends and you could all laugh and point at the poor, naive heretic while you slap each others' backs.
Hey,, you might even join hands and pray for my Hell-bound soul since I am obviously not capable of understanding the concept of all-loving, omnipotent sky-people who can see and hear everything, but still let good, Christian people get killed by cars, cancer, famine, wars and stuff like that, impregnates virgins, give birth to themselves, then die but don't really die and joins himself in Heaven afterwards. Now let me go get my monkey costume...