I guess it is not only the US and the US Consulate. To get a Schengen Visa (most countries in Europe) is also not very easy for Chinese.

Many friends told me they got rejected for several times.

Hi,

I know that this post if somewhat off topic but our company managed to get visas issued to several European countries by using inside contacts. They actually got the visas issued and in the passport before the applicants left the building.

These rules are guidelines are best and can be varied at the discretion of the consular staff and if you have the contacts usually are if given sufficient incentive.

However the man in the street is left at the mercy of system.

The post on rejecting the first application in order to get the applicant to reapply is spot on. I knew someone who was rejected 4 times at the Cheng Du consulate but re applied in Beijing and was successful.

A certificate of no impedient from your embassy is what you would need.

Why do you think the place was attacked by a mob a few years ago? You don't think the dips behave better when they are off-duty, do you?

Chinese students compile statistics of rejections at various consulates and post them to web pages. Last I heard, the Shenyang consulate was the worst, rejecting 80% of applications.

If you think the Americans are bad you should try the British! I tried to assist a Chinese girl/woman who had a legitimate 12 month job offer from a very reputable charity in UK. The Chengdu British visa office lied to her and then got the visa price wrong. The application was handled by their Chongqing office and they messed up too. The manager there sent me not one but two e mails promising to sort the mess out and in the end he didn't and she ran out of time and lost the job. Another Chinese friend had a very good degree from one of the top Chinese Universities, his family was very well off and he had an offer to do his Masters at a top British University but ws turned down by the visa office. No wonder people make jokes about civil servants....they are a joke, a sick joke!

FYI - - here's the letter I sent to the Ambassador. I did not include attachment with details as it is 7 pages (Webmaster - - if this is too long, feel free to delete - - JJ)

21 July 2010

The Honorable Jon M. Huntsman, Jr.
Ambassador of the United States
American Embassy
Beijing
Peoples Republic of China

Via E-mail: CIUBeijing@state.gov (hard copy to follow)

Dear Mister Ambassador,

I was dismayed, disappointed and ashamed about the treatment received by/from Consular officials at Chengdu. At best, the treatment was incompetent - - and - - at worst, was totally dishonest.

Details: First, I am a US citizen - - retired - - a Disabled Veteran living in Kunming. I spent a career as a US Navy officer (Navy SEAL). Some folks add "highly decorated" to the description. I was naïve enough to then expect decent treatment from my government.

My wife of 39 years was born in China - - raised in Taiwan - - and is a naturalized US citizen. We both tutor English to select students as our way to be involved in the community and do our small bit for Sino-American relations.

NOTE: Our first trip to China was in 1978 under the auspices of US-China Peoples Friendship Association. My trip report at the time was classified - - but has been declassified and is available should anyone be interested. Again, we had a small part in the "normalization" of relations between the two countries.

I have been under treatment by a doctor of Traditional Chinese Medicine for the past two years. I believe that treatment actually saved my life! In the process, we developed a strong relationship with the doctor's family. We promised the daughter (who is now 16) that if she worked hard and earned her way into the best high school, that we would take her on a holiday with us to the U.S. We even scheduled our trip in August (who would go to Arizona in August??) because that is the only time students had available. The initial application was made 11 April.

I made a personal trip to Chengdu in early June to just make sure we did everything correct. I discussed entire situation with Vice-Consul and was told in these words, "Should be no problem." Plus we followed every single instruction on the webpage. We made all travel arrangements and pre-paid travel (round-trip) tickets and hotel accommodations. After the young lady was denied in early July (details of interview in attachment), we were told she could immediately re-apply - - which we did. The available interview dates were later than our scheduled travel date - - so we requested an expedited interview - - which was granted after I asked it to be done as a "favor" to me. But - - why oh why schedule an expedited interview knowing she is going to be denied again!! Certainly we all believed that the Consulate would never have approved an expedited interview unless she was going to be approved - - and that the Interviewer might actually look at supporting documents this time!! Again - - denied - - after three cursory questions and not even looking at all the supporting documents we had put together in compliance with instructions. And now she has two denials on her record. The second girl (a classmate who was asked to go along as a traveling companion and is also an honor student) was also denied in a perfunctory manner.

The father of one of the girls is a police official. He contacted the Chinese Foreign Affairs Police in Chengdu. After checking details, we were informed that the "unwritten policy" of the Chengdu Consulate is to not issue visas to students unless they were traveling in an "approved" group. Had we been told that from the outset, especially in my face-to-face interview with the Vice-Consul, then we could have arranged group travel and done so before we ran out of time with multiple denials. THE CONSULATE OFFICIALS WERE NOT HONEST WITH US!

In a Press Release entitled, "Why the U.S.-China relationship is the most important in the world," you said, "The US-China relationship is the most complex and vital relationship in the world today." (Press Release 02/11/10)

Secretary Clinton said on 01/12/10 in talking about China that the US should "...reach beyond governments to engage directly with people ..."

Roger Dow, President of US Travel Association said on 06/18/10, that "...China will become the Number One tourist provider to the US with several million visits..."

Actions of the Chengdu Consulate belied every one of those comments.

Four parents - - a doctor - - a Walmart District Manager (Three Provinces) - - a police official - - a business woman - - now all have very, very negative thoughts about the dishonesty of the Consulate personnel and that feeling will be multiplied a thousand and more times over as their story is told and retold.

In a separate attachment, I am detailing the day by day communication and action should you desire to investigate the personnel involved.

So, Mister Ambassador, we are not asking for intervention in visa approval - - as we could not get everything accomplished in time for the girls to be back to start school at the necessary time. What we are asking is an investigation of the personnel and policies involved. If there is to be the transparency promised throughout the government, then the Chengdu Consulate needs to be cleaned out (there are other disturbing questions about some of the personnel).

Very respectfully,

Jerry Jon Fletcher

CC:

AmcitBeijing@state.gove

Governmentrelations@ustravel.org

This could be described as the tip of an iceburg.

Shame on them.

i think, anyone who has anything to do with actuarial works in certain industries, will not be surprised by some "anormalies".

compiled data outside the kingdom shows that "people from one particular region of a certain country" who "overstaying their visa" and "committing workcover/industrial injury/insurance fraud" are unproportionate to be "normal". Shenyang and fujian are sharing the same spot on the radar screen. every region has its own rating.

i bet, some foreign governments like the US, the Brits, Oz, the europeans... have hacked into the system.

JJ
Good luck - although please remember the US Consul Chengdu is probably a career politician and probably will only flap his lips unless the complaint has the potential to go viral. I'd probably follow up with the line, "You're in discussions on how to file a formal complaint with the GAO" for fraud, waste, and abuse - as government employees who charge for services but do not use the formal process are then guilty of fraud - which is a felony with potential financial penalties including jail time.

Knowledge of a felony without reporting it could be considered conspiracy.

Now...since they ticked you off - don't get mad (ok...get mad) - get even. IF the GAO actually launched an investigation (now...really can the government really police itself?) that would return some really serious serious serious pain - probably because the GAO will operate in the same manner - they will go in with a preset GUILTY mindset and turn the event into a witchhunt.

Bear in mind that the consuls also house US intelligence activities - in today's US government environment and with the 7th fleet doing MAJOR ops off China's coast (ostensible rattling sabers to spook crazy DPRK) - everything could conceivably be swept under the rug "in the interest of national security". We used that ploy to kidnap alleged terrorists (both real and imagined), imprison them on a not-so-secret jail, torture them, and now...release most of them into the wild. Unless the brainwashing worked - if they were fence sitters before being kidnapped - they're DEFINITELY not anymore.

Our government has become visibly quite complicated over the last few decades...in the interest of national security...

Thanks all for comments/info. All I asked originally was that my government treat me (one who spent a career in service to the Country) in an honest straight-forward manner.

I have contacted an Immigration Attorney (thru my attorney) and am exploring various avenues. We have already contacted some officials in State Dept, some politicians, some media, etc.

I will keep all informed - - and I'll try to keep it short!!

Cheers - - JJ

It is an unfortunate fact that government diplomats are less than honest and less than straight-forward by training.

If any of them are reading this, you can believe that their response will be; 'The public just doesn't understand that we are simply doing our job.' Well, we expect them to be overseas civil servants and, thus, setting an example.

Perhaps, their concern is that this particular item (it's just an item to them) will open the flood gates. Well, who caused the flood. Experienced professionals should be able to manage that (Mmn, perhaps this is the nub of the matter).