Michael,

"Profanities" aside, my original assessment has been confirmed by you, you have admitted to not knowing what you were talking about; you were "mindlessly passing on propaganda without...think[ing] critically." Having establishing that, it makes any other arguments you make that much more unconvincing.

The core issue of this thread, was not about China "repaying war debts to the former USSR" or any type of war debt, that was of your own creation. Actually, it was not even about health care as you are now wishing to explore. It was simply to criticize the the comment made regarding an article, to associate Maoism with equality and the absurdity of such arguments.

It was not an attack on China or the CCP, but apparently, you perceived such slight and felt obligated to defend China. Health care is not an issue I wish to debate, at least not tonight. We get it, it's not China's fault, no country has done a better job than China and if they did, it's because of the unique problem that exists only in China as it is the only country with 1.4 billion people so they should be excused; China is doing a great job considering the facts.

I am not here to challenge your opinions, you are entitled to yours as I am to mine. However, do not confuse personal opinions with fact and present it as such with dubious sources.

My use of the term 'Maoism' was a bad one, and I've admitted it. There was indeed a greater policy focus on, if not equal, at least attainable levels of basic health care for all before 1980 than after. Since then the state has recognized the problem and is attempting to make up for this, and I wish them the best in doing so, but the point remains that plenty of people have health care issues in China that they cannot afford to deal with, and so the present focus is a corrective. It needs to go further.

Who knows. Maybe it was deliberately used as an implicit guesture, and a support for various maoist guerillas.

Still not talkin about good or bad here, the word just, sort of, caught a corner in the eye.

And as Ive said, no big deal here anyway...well, of course, as long as this guerilla aint knocking on the door, and gonna cone and force one into some marxist agriculture collective.

Alien,

I am not versed well enough regarding Chinese health care policies pre and post 1980s to be able to verify the truthfulness of your contention, as is the case with the public in general since this is not common knowledge. Please provide sources to support the argument that "There was indeed a greater policy focus on ... equal, ... attainable levels of basic health care for all before 1980 than after [in China]"; without support, your statement becomes a false, baseless allegation intended to further a self-serving narrative that is intellectually dishonest.

And let me be blunt here, by delineating between pre and post economic reforms (i.e., Communism/Socialistic model vs. Capitalistic/Market-Oriented model), praising the former and denouncing the latter, you are romanticizing an era in which millions of people died from failed policies that are inherent in an autocratic system, with a belief that free health care was available to all and advocating we go back to that period.

By not owning up to the realties of history associated with such era, your advocacy for a return is very dangerous and irresponsible. The subtle and casual association of a inhumane era with a positive (but misguided) idea of free health care for all, makes it even more dangerous, if not callous. While such rhetorics may be simply an intellectual exercise for you, it does have a tangible consequence to a nation of 1.4 billion people.

Since 1978, China has been evolving towards individual freedoms and away from absolute power of the state. In the last couple of years such progress is slowing down as the government is once again becoming more heavy-handed in some areas while liberalizing in others. As I see it, China is now the cusp of a new era that will determine the trajectory of its future; a fondness for a by-gone era is really a step backwards for all of mankind.

And if any one questions, I am speaking as a husband of a Chinese national and the future father of one (or several). I have an inherent interest in the future development of China (and the US) as that has a direct and personal impact myself and my family.

No denunciation, no romanticization, no advocacy of going back, just a suggestion that some things might have been continued in the direction that was started, concerning health care, rather than dumping them and then having to start again (and yes, this is an exaggeration - there remains a policy for a basic level of health care, which started in the 1950s).

I have no admiration for the disasters of the Great Leap Forward or the Cultural Revolution or the ills of autocratic government - if you want to get into all of that, start another thread.

Alien,

To "[suggest] that some things... [should be] continued in the direction that was started" would imply that it has ceased.

Please illustrate using examples, better if you have sources, to support the claim that "there was indeed a greater policy focus on ... equal [and] attainable levels of basic health care for all before 1980 than after [in China]." And please enlighten us on what changed in 1980 to cause such a change. My ears are wide open.

And I would further challenge you to explain why the pursuit of a policy is more important than the actual improvement in health care. In other words, pre-1980 when the Chinese Government was pursuing a policy of free, equal health care access for all (according to you) the health care that the average Chinese citizen is able to actually receive is less than today, when the policy of free, equal health care access for all was abandoned. You have a tendency to irresponsibility throw out ideas, claims, and accusations without ever explaining yourself or backing those up with facts or sources. I think it is time that you do so. What are the merits of of a free, equal health care access for all in the context of China and how can this be achieved without adding to the burden of it's citizens. How can the current system be change to make it more equitable to all citizens without deteriorating the access currently enjoyed by the many.