@laotou

The supposition is your question is ridiculous to begin with. Why compare only the last 20 years? Maybe because you are cherry picking? Let me turn the table around and ask what has China offered the world in the last 3 years? Answer that.

However, I will humor you. You're entire argument rests upon the fact that the US has not done any good in the last 20 years. So, a single example will refute your argument. Since you used the argument that because millions of people have been lifted out poverty in China, the CCP is beyond reproach, I will put forth the argument that if it wasn't for the US government's policy of promoting consumption, nobody will be buying Chinese made goods in the quantity that resulted in the said said people being lifted out of poverty. It is the same economic engine fueled by US consumption that is still lifting Chinese peasant out of poverty today.

Furthermore, since you are the benefactor of the US's favorable immigration policy, and since you contributed So much to manKind with your 3G network and the opportunities presented to you in the US, ergo, positive contributions by the US has been made.

So now, back to my question, what has this got to do with finding political message on a RMB?

Laotou is a bitter man - somebody, please give him some sugar to shut him up.

DAZZER
Your contention is that a consumer based US society, buying cheap chinese crap (after decades of buying and bitching and whining about cheap japanese crap) is an example of US awesomeness, on par with invading the middle east and the global financial crisis. Hmm...well...national consumerism of cheap chinese goods makes the USA an awesome nation. We also import over USD 40 billion a year in illegal drugs from Mexico - but if your buddies @liumingke1234, @geezer, et al can concur that THIS is an awesome event on par with invading Iraq, destabilizing the middle east, or causing a global financial crisis through pervasive and fraudulent (but legal) financial practices - I'll concede the point reluctantly - although contending that the USA's consumer based society is awesome is a really bitter pill to swallow as a sugar substitute, when compared to putting a man on the moon.

Assuming for the moment that Liumingke & Geezer do NOT agree that US consumerism of Chinese goods is an awesome display of USA-ness - please cite any example - any example. Go back 30 years if you must. Let's start with any time AFTER we put the first man on the moon - that was a monumental event in history that showed the world the USA is totally awesome.

Something, anything to act as a single cherry-picked counter to my long list above - surely your combined minds can come up with a single illustration. @geezer was able to immediately cherry pick 2014 as a bumper tax-paying year for BoA, despite the fact that 2012 was a ZERO tax paying year for BoA - that was only THREE years back, but we're nitpicking - let's bring it back to the off-topic top.

If you, Liuming, et al have a single cube of sugar to share, please share it and help me to just shut up permanently for everyone's benefit - especially my own.

I'll even terminate my laotou account and do my very very best to NOT re-register as laotou v2 if that's an incentive (please note if that's an incentive).

This is your BIG chance to shut the lout up, shut this mother down, terminate BS is BS, and get rid of a verbose, prolific and generally annoying if not entertaining pest.

All it takes is your combined intelligence to post a single incidence of US awesomeness of similar magnitude to invading Iraq, the global financial crisis, et al.

Just one piece of sugar is all I'm asking for...surely your combined efforts can produce something?

And for your information - my naturalized US citizenship can be revoked at the US government's whim. I am NOT a real US citizen - I just get to live and pay taxes, which the green card also provides. Citizenship allowed me to work on frighteningly awesome military technology and weapons systems a la Wen HoLee. Y'all remember that guy right? He was LUCKY that's ALL they did to him.

So - ONE cherry picked piece of sugar. And don't forget to tell me to terminate my laotou account if that's part of the deal - I put it on the table - up to any or all of you to acknowledge the offer to make it valid.

Why use blackmail and set tests. You are not a child. You should stop wrecking threads and destroying this forum, because it's the right thing to do. Let the forum breathe fresh air. Allow others to discuss topics other than Latou's 'hard life'. You've become an embarrassment. You are a father; would you allow your children to act the way you do? Ask GK for a dedicated channel.

Is admitting you are wrong so difficult? And now you are changing the goal post a la Matt.

You asked for an example in which US policies have resulted in positive effect on the world. Since you cited China lifting millions of peasants out of poverty as good, and since those peasants can't be lifted out of poverty without US consumption, we can logically claim that the US had a hand in lifting millions of poor Chinese peasants out of poverty. Intent is irrelevant, morality of the action is irrelevant, only the goodness of the end result is relevant. If we are to imply the intent rule, then CCP does not get the credit for helping peasants either because that was not their intent, only a side consequence of their actions.

You wanted more examples post 1969 in which the US contributed positivist to mankind? How about the entire space exploration program? The fall of the Berlin wall, the fall of the USSR, all the innovations from Silicon Valley, the tech boom from which you benefited from (or not)?

Again, if you wish to continue this discussion, stick to the points at hand without going off on another rambling tangent. You employ blitzkrieg style arguments, hoping sheer verbiage will overpower your opponent, then feign self-deprecation to taught them. And yet, you are only showing your true colors in the process and losing all credibility.

So I guess it's a self-fulfilling prophecy, when you call yourself and old man, you'd end up rambling like an old man.

Case closed.

The Americans have taken over.

Ill just intervene and say, China's growth I'm sure is'nt dependent on America. Remember, and I'm sure this may come as news to some of you on here, but there are more countries in the world that just America and China.

If America decided it didn't want Chinese goods tomorrow then I'm sure it would be a blow, but Europe works it's way through Chinese products too and Africa can't get enough Chinese things.

I'm sure if you visited Australasia or any other Asia country you would also have a weath of things made in China to choose from.

Now, if everyone has had their say on a 1 yuan note with a political message on it, then let that be that.

If you want to moan about USA/Iranian relations then I'm sure there is a forum in America or Iran that caters for these things.

What you're doing here is the equivalent of walking into a barbers and asking for a loaf of bread.

Blackmail is coercion - I offered, voluntarily, therefore there is no coercion, no blackmail.

I have a bad habit of hijacking threads and it has to stop. The gokm team has been extremely tolerant, but it's time for some self policing. I can't help myself, because I see only negative things - so for me there's only one solution. Give me sugar and I'll terminate. It's a bit drastic, but effective.

@napolean
I've lived most of my life across the asia pacific rim, to arguably include 13 years in Australia. When we lived in Australia - the health inspector came by a family friend's new restaurant and banned him from using soy sauce as a cooking ingredient - claiming it was toxic, poisonous, and unhealthy...although Worcestershire Sauce is permissible...go figure.

I haven't lived in the USA for roughly 20 years, so I'm totally out of touch with "what is America today" and "what are Americans". My exposure to Americans living overseas was corporate executive management - and in a rare case of understatement, it wasn't pleasant. So, I'm a short fuse when I meet people like that, with their thinly veiled, and incredibly obscene and offensive hidden agendas.

US CONSUMERISM.
For US Trade with China - a simple check of US Trade figures will show the magnitude of that trade and it is considerable, as China currently occupies "most favored nation" trade status with the USA (I think it still does). Somehow - that doesn't inspire me to jump up and down and say "YEAH! I'm proud to be an American, cuz I'm buying Chinese goods to alleviate poverty in China!"

Aside from the former USSR, no other nation has the power to rather permanently obliterate entire nations, within a matter of minutes.

You're right - there are other forums - but this is the opportunity for me to get rid of myself, for public benefit, so since I've already hijacked this thread, please bear with me just a little longer - we're almost there.

A few one-liner zingers, like:

"Put a man on the moon"

would suffice amply, as sugar.

INTERNET
That's a good one. I'll have to dwell on that one - but looks good. Thank you.

In case anyone's interested, the internet was originally the spawn of the US Government's DARPA - Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency, although Al Gore also claimed he created the internet. Can I jump up and down and say, "YEAH! We created the internet! HooRAH!"? Difficult at worst, incredibly silly at best.

US CONSUMPTION
That's a long stretch, implying the intent of US consumption was to alleviate poverty in China - but if there's consensus - I can go with that. The poverty alleviation number was hundreds of millions - exceeding the entire population of the USA at roughly 300 million (illegal aliens notwithstanding). Again - difficult to jump up and down and say I'm proud to be American because I'm buying Chinese goods to help China alleviate poverty. Doing that in a bar in the USA might invoke a physical beat down from the BUY AMERICAN crowd.

USSR
The USSR spawned the space race, by putting the first man into space. The USA had to play catch up - so they put a man on the moon. That absolutely was a moment of global awesomeness.

The fall of the USSR is a debatable achievement - as it's ideologically based AND they're back and re-arming, giving the NATO budget renewed life. However, "YEAH! We caused to USSR to fail as a government! I'm proud to be American!"...might work for some, doesn't work for me - ALTHOUGH Reagan's famous Berlin Wall speech to Gorbachev was epically fantastic and exciting - that guy was an epic showman.

SILICON VALLEY
Maybe. I'm trying to balance the awesomeness of Silicon Valley with rendition, aggressive interrogation, and long-term incarceration in solitary confinement, the invasion of the middle east, and the spawning of ISIS, amongst other things. I'm having difficulty. However, your contention is the Silicon Valley wonder re-qualifies as an awesome nation.

Bearing in mind - the USA also embargoed China and the USSR, so they could NOT develop home-grown computers and systems for decades - a military/national security issue. But - interesting and worth consideration. Can I jump up and down and say "Yay! America created the internet - I'm PROUD to be an American!" Despite the fact that this is/was one of my professional responsibilities and puts food on the table - difficult to get excited over that one - but familiarity breeds contempt - but still...

@nnoble
Yes, I'm a father. I want the world to be a better place for my children. I don't want them to have experience the things I experienced consistently in US corporate life. My job is to educate them on how to recognize, avoid, or mitigate such potential disasters. I could teach them to shut up and be good quiet chinese stereotypical workers. However, the opportunity for corporate abuse is real and present if you're an achiever - NOT limited to USA corporate culture.

The sugar I was seeking is something that makes us jump up and down like an excited moron (a la Tom Cruise's famous meltdown) and yell to the world, "YEAH! I'm American and proud of it! Look at what we did! Awesome right?". Something genuinely celebratory - but maybe that's excessively lofty and unreasonable - but it would take something of that magnitude to offset a global financial crisis and a now publicly acknowledged, but misguided invasion and destabilization of not just a sovereign country, but an entire global region with its own name.

@tony
I blitz people when a conversation goes personal. Like "liar", BS, etc. These are and will always be the tools of bullies and coercive tactics. I've been bullied all my life and I've NEVER backed down from what I perceive as right and wrong, because that's what it is. My father gave that gift to me as a small child of Chinese descent, living in a white man's world. Bullies trying to get me to "go with the flow", "be a team player", and my all time favorites (used unsuccessfully on me twice), "Turn over all your professional relationships"...etc for their personal agendas at my expense, both financial and criminal.

Chinese and Japanese societies are generally "go with the flow". So I'm exceptionally, if not irrationally touchy, when people begin conversations like Laotou is a liar, BS is BS, and aspersion to my loyalty and patriotism to the USA, etc as they've all been pre-cursors to attempts to foist major and significant fraudulent and or criminal activity onto my head - the scapegoat and I'm nobody's scapegoat. My patriotism to the USA is prolifically documented and verifiable by the US Department of Defense and the US State Department. I may NOT have stood in front of bullets or sucked up carcinogens (got another tangential story on that one), but I contributed significantly, conscientiously, and to the best of my professional abilities to my country - for which I was poorly compensated and I don't get to wear ribbons or uniforms to display my patriotism. I'm actually forbidden by federal and criminal law to confirm or deny any and or all activities during that part of my life. So those of you who cast aspersions to my loyalty or patriotism to the USA can go put a sock in it, suck on it, and go vote for Trump - he's a kindred spirit.

Maybe it's out of line to jump all over Dazzer, Geezer, Tony, et al - but that's the world I've lived in and it was American AND British. I'm abrasive, hot tempered, and argumentative and I can be viciously vitreous, because of the people I've worked with and worked for. I'm nobody's scapegoat and nobody's doormat.

When people attempt to use coercive and interject personal insults, innuendo, etc to make their respective counter-points - they lose credibility and respect to me and I'm unfortunately NEVER one to shy away from an affront. Some may call me oversensitive - but it's saved me from jail, professional disgrace, financial ruin, and even more terrifying and unbelievable experiences - think Wen HoLee and when I say he was LUCKY - that's not an exaggeration. The US government can be vindictive and petty when they choose - and that's taught in US History at the high school level.

But you're right - enough is enough. I'll talk to Yereth about terminating my account for me. There's more to life than pointless sparring with Geezer et al and I'm really using this as an excuse to procrastinate - hence the need to be drastic and burn that bridge and remove the temptation.

That said - thanks again to the now not-so-new gokm team and owners for continuing to operate a fantastic online English-language resource and for being exceptionally tolerant of laotou.

For the spectators - I urge you to call out online bullying and apologize for subjecting you all to my US focused rants. I'm still bent out of shape, because I see all these things as connected, egregiously hypocritical, and ominously dangerous.

I'm entirely unapologetic for China rah rah rah and trust the government will continue with it's missions of social responsibility. For those of you who care, social responsibility, poverty alleviation, and rural welfare have been on EVERY five year plan, since their original inception.

To me - the rural people represent the ¥1 or ¥0.01, but they are and have been the strength and the weakness of this nation since the beginning of Chinese history.

Sometimes - people go to the barber for conversation. The haircut is just a side benefit...

I do not wish to waste more space to dwell on the inadequacies of your argument, however, I do want to offer one last example as a Coup de grâce.

You said, "That's a long stretch, implying the intent of US consumption was to alleviate poverty in China"

I did not state, explicitly or implicitly that the intent of the US consumption was to alleviate poverty, on the contrary, US consumerism is designed to feed the corporate greed that is running rampant. I had actually stated "Intent is irrelevant, morality of the action is irrelevant, only the...end result is relevant."

Again, without Nixon visiting China, it might not have paved way for the market-reforms of Deng in 78/79. Without US corporations investing in China in the early 80s thus spurning domestic capital investment, and the US consumers consuming Chinese output in the 90s thus kick starting the massive Chinese economic engine, China would not have been able to lift so many people out of poverty. And so if you wish to cite the lifting of Chinese peasants out of poverty as a good being done by the CCP, you would also need to give credit to the US as well.

Yes, Africa and Europe takes a large share of Chinese trade today, but without the US involvement early on, China would not be where it is today.

So now I have repeated my arguments 3 times and you chose to either distort or ignore them each time. You wanted examples of how US contributed to the welfare of mankind and after being presented with the evidence, you choose to quantify it, and in essence, claim it doesn't count.

One last nail in the coffin. You admitted that you have not lived in the US for the last 20 years, and yet you've paid your taxes? Exactly how much have you paid (rhetorical question, I do not want to pry into your personal affairs) Somehow I doubt the tax form would meet the same stringent requirements as those in the US. For one, since there is no way to verify your income, there is great likelihood that many incomes subject to taxation were not reported. But then, it's just conjecture on my part and I will desist on this point. Since you have not lived in the US for the last 20 years, what have you done to make America better? So then, are you one of those people that expects everyone else to take action but yourself?

Finally, to summarize my position, I don't believe governments act in accordance to what they believe to be good or bad, they only act to serve their own interests, to maintain or amass more power. To say China is good and the US is bad or vice versa is the laughable paradigm of fools. I've always opposed labels and will always speak out against distortions for the sake of distortions.

..

@latou. 'I'll talk to Yereth about terminating my account for me.'.

If you need someone to support your application, do not hesitate to ask.

Every Olympics, someone breaks the world record for the 100 meter and we have a new Fastest Man in the World.

The Apollo 11 was the first manned mission to land on the Moon on July 20, 1969.

You mean to tell me that with all the new technology we have in the last 46 years we can not put another person on the moon or did we totally lose interest?

If you need a rocket to break free of the earth's gravitational pull wouldn't you also need a smaller rocket to break free of the moons gravitational pull as well.

Someone please ask Stanley to answer all these questions.